so, season 4

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so, season 4

Postby B » Tue Apr 13, 2010 11:38 pm

holy shit
tmbg13 wrote:If my sickly grandmother was in a team with Pulp and Sexual Nightmare, I would vote against her. Also I would be all like "grandma why"
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Re: so, season 4

Postby Zack Hoagie » Tue Apr 13, 2010 11:52 pm

I know, right. The beginning or the end?
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Re: so, season 4

Postby B » Wed Apr 14, 2010 12:14 pm

All of it. I've never seen a season of television that comes CLOSE to matching that.
tmbg13 wrote:If my sickly grandmother was in a team with Pulp and Sexual Nightmare, I would vote against her. Also I would be all like "grandma why"
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Re: so, season 4

Postby Jon » Wed Apr 14, 2010 12:52 pm

SPOILERS
DO NOT READ UNLESS YOU HAVE FINISHED SEASON FOUR







Yeah, even if the first three seasons were fucking Law and Order, it'd still be worth it to watch through them just to get to Season 4. Definitely the greatest season of television I've ever seen, and stacked against any other non-Wire dramatic TV show, it's really not even a contest.

It probably goes without saying that the kids are the best part of this season. Watching Randy (to pick one example) evolve from a happy, friendly kid to a teenager whose life has been completely destroyed was a tremendously powerful experience.

The presentation of the school system is absolutely unbelievable. The people and the atmosphere in the school is 100% authentic. A friend of mine used to work as a substitute teacher in inner-city middle schools -- after seeing this he couldn't believe how on the money everything was. It was also really cool to watch Prezbo, a guy who cares about his kids and is wrestling over whether he can actually care too much about them, and remember that when the show started he was an obnoxious worthless fuck-up.

Bodie's death was one of the most emotional moments I've ever seen. In a show that has featured, like, 40 outstanding characters, he may have been my favorite. We got to watch this guy grow up -- he shot Wallace, he rose up in the ranks, he tried to figure out what the fuck The Prairie Home Companion was, and by the fourth season he was the old man of the corners at age 20. D'Angelo was intelligent enough to realize how decrepit the business was, but it didn't really seem to register with Bodie until his last few months. He figures out pretty rapidly that he has no outs and that his life is going nowhere, he despairs, and then he's dead. Jesus Christ.
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Re: so, season 4

Postby B » Wed Apr 14, 2010 1:11 pm

That's definitely it for me. The whole moment is four years of storytelling coming to a head. The best part for me is the moment right before it happens, where Bodie starts noticing the people around him and seeing what's about to happen. I love that a show can have a character realize something internally and externally and have those realizations be symbolically parallel, one literal and one figurative, without losing control of the narrative for a SECOND. It's maybe the most ace moment of storytelling I've ever seen anywhere. Poot's plea for reason, the referencing of the chess board a few scenes earlier (Bodie realizing he's still just a pawn) from FOUR SEASONS ago, the dramatic standoff (which almost nobody on The Wire gets) contrasting with the brutal, instant moment of death and the "finish them off with a headshot" capper... god dammit, I feel like I just read a 20,000 page novel about humanity.

The best part is that those last two episodes are FULL of stuff like this. The hold on the neighborhood at the end of the season finale burned itself into my brain for hours after I finished watching it, to the point that I had trouble sleeping.
tmbg13 wrote:If my sickly grandmother was in a team with Pulp and Sexual Nightmare, I would vote against her. Also I would be all like "grandma why"
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Re: so, season 4

Postby B » Wed Apr 14, 2010 1:16 pm

Going back and watching the chess scene from season one, I'm really struck by Bodie's insistance that if he "makes it to the end," he wins.
tmbg13 wrote:If my sickly grandmother was in a team with Pulp and Sexual Nightmare, I would vote against her. Also I would be all like "grandma why"
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Re: so, season 4

Postby Ragingape » Wed Apr 14, 2010 2:17 pm

Jon wrote:The presentation of the school system iss absolutely unbelievable. The people and the atmosphere in the school is 100% authentic. A friend of mine used to work as a substitute teacher in inner-city middle schools -- after seeing this he couldn't believe how on the money everything was. It was also really cool to watch Prezbo, a guy who cares about his kids and is wrestling over whether he can actually care too much about them, and remember that when the show started he was an obnoxious worthless fuck-up.

This is without a doubt an example of why I love The Wire. It nails everything. The police department is a real police department with budget crises and bullshit stat meetings but the school was unbelievable. My fiancee taught in south side Chicago schools and when she heard what Season 4 was she couldn't wait to get there. She was not disappointed by how true to life everything was and she was ecstatic in Season 5 when Dookie goes back to school and you see that Prezbo has figured it out and become a good teacher/authority figure.

For me the transformation of Carver was what I was invested in but Bodie was the story I liked. The scene of him and McNulty talking on the bench might be my favorite in the series. (That's a lie. It's Omar in court but still Bodie is awesome.)
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Re: so, season 4

Postby Kane » Thu Apr 15, 2010 3:26 am

I've suggested this before but a LoS for the greatest characters in The Wire would be fairly awesome
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Re: so, season 4

Postby B » Thu Apr 15, 2010 6:21 am

I like how the longer the show goes, the less I like Lester Freamon. It's like yeah, he's cool and smart and everything, but I'm pretty sure even Poot has more character development than him at this point.
tmbg13 wrote:If my sickly grandmother was in a team with Pulp and Sexual Nightmare, I would vote against her. Also I would be all like "grandma why"
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Re: so, season 4

Postby Andy » Thu Apr 15, 2010 9:40 am

Season 4 is 100% the best season of television ever made, for reasons already listed and beyond. All those kids kill me in every way and it's amazing. I can't believe nobody mentioned Michael yet. His love for his brother and hatred of an abusive parental figure actually created the monster that consumed him, and watching THAT transformation, and the rest of his story in season five is one of the reasons this show may never be topped.
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Re: so, season 4

Postby David » Thu Apr 15, 2010 3:08 pm

Everything everyone has said is completely true. Season 4 basically ripped me apart.
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Re: so, season 4

Postby Zack Hoagie » Thu Apr 15, 2010 7:02 pm

B wrote:I like how the longer the show goes, the less I like Lester Freamon. It's like yeah, he's cool and smart and everything, but I'm pretty sure even Poot has more character development than him at this point.


If that's the case Season 5 will make you pretty happy.
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Re: so, season 4

Postby Nicholas » Thu Apr 15, 2010 9:55 pm

Jon wrote:he shot Wallace.


The show's ability to gradually turn Bodie from the murderer of the first season's most sympathetic and hopeful character (and a goddamn child) into HIMSELF the most sympathetic and hopeful character is what separates is from anything else I've seen. It might just be that because I was so desperate for anybody to make good out of the corners that I was willing to so totally embrace Bodie, but it just speaks again to the abilities of the writers and actors to make me see these people as able to change and not caricatures (no way Bodie isn't anything but a bad-guy forever in any other series).

Can't wait to talk about season 5, my favorite.
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Re: so, season 4

Postby phil5329 » Sat Apr 17, 2010 2:02 pm

Bodie was def my favorite character and I was very :depressed when he got shot

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Re: so, season 4

Postby BeeJ » Sat Jul 31, 2010 10:10 pm

Hey guys, a few months late but still

Just finished watching this season. Motherfucking wow. I had made sure not to come into this topic until I was done to avoid spoilers, and the one thing I really wanted to post was "Season 4 Bodie is my favorite", and then goddammit. Seeing him get shot was so infuriating (in the way it's supposed to be).

I think the most incredible moment this season for me was when Chris kills Bug's dad. The number of layers and complexity of who's-a-good-guy-who's-a-bad-guy is just off the charts here. This whole time up to that scene, we had wondered why Michael hated the guy so much (or maybe I had just missed something), and it looked like the dad was really trying to take care of his kid now that he was home. And then it all comes together when we realize that the guy was a child molester, and suddenly the most coldhearted killer on the show becomes an instantenous warrior of righteousness by killing him. But then, it also occurred to me that this was also partially a hate-crime because the victim admitted to his homosexual past just beforehand. And then, of course, there's the WAY he was killed -- not with a single shot to the head -- but by getting PUNCHED IN THE FACE TO DEATH. Chris clearly cares about Michael. So many layers. So many fucking layers.

By the end of season two, I couldn't stand Herc and Carver. I honestly considered them bad guys, so seeing Carver's evolution into Cop of the People is awesome. Conversely, seeing Herc being the root of SO many mistakes and deaths this season was just maddening. Prez isn't allowed to be a cop anymore, but this guy is somehow able to slide through 12 episodes before being suspended. I hope to hell he's gone from the force when season five starts.

Overall, now that I'm at the end, it seems like this season was really just a setup for season five. By that I simply mean that hardly anything was resolved this time. The first three seasons all had big raids at the end, but this one only had a list of bodies. And I get it, that's the point. There's no resolution, especially for the kids. After everything Carver tried to do, Randy is still getting blacklisted. The end was just so, so disheartening. This show is fucking powerful.
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